NY Times Begs Men to Date Again: Why They're Opting Out

In this episode, Simone and the host analyze a New York Times article titled, 'Men, Where Have You Gone? Please Come Back.' The conversation delves into how conservative media reacted to the piece and critiques their misinterpretations. Themes include the retreat of men from traditional dating spaces, the impact of feminism and sexual liberation on the dating marketplace, and personal anecdotes that highlight the current disconnection between men and women in modern dating. The script also touches on the role of personal expectations, urban monoculture, and the need for men and women to reevaluate their dating strategies and societal roles.

Malcolm Collins: Hello Simone. I'm excited to be here with you today. Today we are gonna be discussing an article that has done the rounds in conservative media. I saw it before it did the rounds. I was like, we should do an episode on this, but it makes more sense for evergreen content which was a New York Times piece titled, men Where Have You Gone?

Mm-hmm. Please Come Back. So Many Men Retreated from intimacy, hiding behind firewalls, filters, and curated personas, dabbling and scrolling. We miss you. What they've been, we're the, they're here, they're right here. No, they actually have left the environments that these women are within.

Simone Collins: Oh, they're not on Blue Sky?

Malcolm Collins: Well, no, it's not that they're not on Blue Sky. They're not dating in the way that these women are dating. They're dating in the environments that these women are dating.

I will note, , while a lot of right ringers have covered this particular article, I think they have missed the larger point in it just to make the dunks. They want to make like, oh, feminist pushed us out. This is all women's fault. You know, women are the worst. When I really think there is an interesting thing to describe here, which is what we're gonna go into, which is why don't you see men at restaurants anymore?

Why don't you see men in these sorts of fancy environments anymore? This isn't just downstream of what we think of as. Big, bad miss Andre

and so what we are seeing is the perception of what dating is like for one of these post-feminist women in an environment. Because this woman is in her fifties.

She was, she she in her fifties and

Simone Collins: she's dating,

Malcolm Collins: she's got kids, she's previously married, she's done this whole thing before. So she is contrasting dating today was what dating was like in the past. And you can say, oh, well, you know, she's post wall. The thing is, is that when you're in your fifties, you're so post wall, you're no longer in the shock of I'm 35 and why won't men day me anymore?

I think that, that she is actually cataloging a difference in dating marketplaces between now and what the marketplaces were like 30 years ago. Oh. Or 20 years ago. Right. And I think that what we see from this piece really interestingly is sort of the decimation feminism has wrought upon her generation and the generation that attempted to espouse it, but not just feminism, but sexual liberation.

And a lot of people have written like follow up pieces, like, oh, this is great. Like men, you really should reengage. And a lot of people are like, bro, men should not be having casual sex in their fifties. Like, you know, this is clearly like not good advice, right? Like this woman is searching for something that only harms everyone that she engages with.

So let's dig into it. By the way, I looked up a picture of the author. She's not like terrible looking or anything. She's fine. Especially if you're a 50-year-old. Well, I

Simone Collins: mean, typically if you're a contributor to the New York Times, like you're a fairly high class, like upper class, educated, successful person.

So that should not,

Malcolm Collins: which in your mind means skinny.

Simone Collins: I think obesity probably is higher with lower income levels. Yeah,

Malcolm Collins: true. But not, not lower about the online writer types. You know, there's lots of them out there. You know, it could be anyway,

May 17th, a warm Saturday night in Wicker Park, a vibrant stretch of Chicago where seven restaurants crowd a single block. Tori and I are having dinner at Mama Delia. One of the quieter spots, the sidewalk patio held five tables, three, two tops, including ours, and a pair pulled together for a group of eight women at those tables.

Troy was the only man. The scene was beautiful, low lights, shared plates, shoulders angled. In the kind of evening people wait for all winter. Still, I found myself watching the crowd as it moved past us, women walking in pairs or alone dressed with care at table after table at the nearby restaurants, there was a noticeable absence of men, at least men seated in what looked like dates.

Simone Collins: Hmm. Yeah.

Malcolm Collins: Now this is really fascinating to me. And we're gonna be talking about other anecdotal evidence from her, but it's something that I have seen as well, especially in fancy cities like New York, Chicago, stuff like this. These are the environments where men have seen the most benefit from just leaning out of the dating market if they're not in the top one or 2%.

Simone Collins: Yeah.

Malcolm Collins: This is a reminder for people who don't know the average man on male in terms of attractiveness gets swiped right on by Less than 1% of women women are completely delusional around what their market value is around this stuff, especially if they're also engaging in casual sex, which you can see this woman is.

So she is likely, like many of these other women saying, I just will not date men of this category. When you go out and you push for equal salaries for men and women, and then you say, well, and I want a man. That, that earns more than me, that means that half or more than half of women, especially in urban environments where they're overwhelming women and where women earn more than men are going to be single.

Simone Collins: Yeah.

Malcolm Collins: And the question is, is what are men doing? Right. Well, I can imagine very few men who would get any satisfaction from going out and eating alone at a restaurant. I can imagine very few men who want to hang out with a group of men at a restaurant where they are overpaying for food and alcohol.

Yeah.

Simone Collins: Especially these days, restaurants are so expensive.

Malcolm Collins: Restaurants are about signaling something to yourself mm-hmm. And to other people. Yeah. So where are the groups of men going? They are going to the other men's houses to play land parties and, and, and stuff like that. Or if they're eating

Simone Collins: out, maybe it's like a sports bar where it's more of like a social fun environment where there's a game playing like it's

Malcolm Collins: that.

But it is, it is not fancy restaurants. There is no reason a man would do this.

Simone Collins: No. And our fancy restaurants are like increasingly for Instagram and for the photos and, well, it's not

Malcolm Collins: just Instagram. It's so that this woman could signal something to herself about who she is and the type of life she's living.

And you see this all the way back in Sex and the City is that they would often meet at fancy restaurants, whereas no male group would ever meet at fancy restaurants.

Simone Collins: Gosh, the feminization of restaurants underrated.

Malcolm Co